Watch the webinar recording above for full presentation on IVF with donor eggs for women over 40. We are glad you have found it very informative – we have received a very positive feedback from the viewers and even more questions to our fertility expert – Dr Uljana Dorofeyeva. Enjoy the video and stay tuned for more webinars from EggDonationFriends.
IVF over 40 – Q&A
Below you can find the complete transcript of the webinar with the Questions asked by the attendees and answers by Dr Uljana Dorofeyeva.
How do you deal with hydrosalpinx (blocked fallopian tube and fluid in the tubes) and the ability to affect implantation?
Hydrosalpinx is really impacting the health status of the patient’s pelvis. We believe it should be laparoscopically taken out from the body because the tubes are not playing any role in the implantation in case we’re doing IVF. But by the presence of the hydrosalpinx, we’re keeping the influence in our ways, and also the changes with immune factors, and the influencing factors on the blood level, on the cell level, for the better implantation. Also all our pelvis organs are moving all the time, so if the tubes are not blocked, we’re not able to tell if they’re blocked for sure, if they are not connected with the cavity of the uterus, so we’re not going transfer embryos into the uterus until the hydrosalpinx is there. So the best recommendation is to have laparoscopy to remove hydrosalpinx and prepare for the embryo transfer.
Would rheumatoid arthritis have any impact on pregnancy success – as it is an autoimmune disease?
Rheumatoid arthritis is not something that we call the main factor of playing the negative role. This is additional category of the patient which needs immune investigation. I would say in 85%, even 90% of those, we find the additional immune suppression or unhealthy activity of the immune system. We perform immune treatment for those patients, but not for rheumatoid arthritis itself, but for the results of the additional investigation which treatment.
Would being on medications for asthma (Uniphyllin, Montelukast (Singulair) and Levocetrizine) impact getting pregnant?
The somatic status – I haven’t mentioned it during my webinar. The somatic status of the patient is really important as well. For any kind of additional somatic or chronic diseases we should be informed. There’s a list. For some specific cases pregnancy is not allowed. It’s not the case of asthma. Also, for this patient (asking the question) we don’t know the level of asthma, how intense it is. If the treating physician allows the patient to have the IVF treatment and carry the pregnancy, so then we’re able to perform the treatment and we’re able, together with treating physician, with recommendations of our doctors to select those medications which could be used for the asthma treatment as well. We’ve had some patients before and we treated them very well but it all depends on good communication between the IVF doctor and the treating physician of the patient.
I had a natural pregnancy at 39 and live birth, 3 IUIs at age 43, the second IUI resulting in a pregnancy but a miscarriage followed at 10 weeks. Would it be worth trying IVF with own eggs before trying with donor egg?
There are statistics of 3-10% for pregnancy and live birth for the patients over 40. But potentially miscarriages happen due to the quality of the embryo. We’re talking about euploid embryo which has been implanted and grown for some period of time but didn’t really have the potential to be delivered as a healthy baby. We’re talking about the potential need of PGS testing in order to understand that we’re getting euploid embryos and the chances for the implantation and live birth are the highest possible and the chances for miscarriage are really low and this will not happen because of the embryo quality. If we still have the possibility to get some oocytes again, and the patient is willing to try again, so there is no medical contraindication not to try. But we need to be focused on the statistics and we need to realize what the real chances are. And maybe the next step would be egg donation after trying again with IVF or maybe we should do combined treatment with PGS in order to understand what the potential is, etc. So we need to have the AMH here. we need to have the antral follicle count, the number of the oocytes which are responding and growing to get the answer for gonadotropins, stimulation, etc.
I fell pregnant naturally in May but I miscarried. I have done IVF, but didn’t get many eggs. I responded better to Clomid and low dose of FSH, then high dose of FSH/LH. My fertilisation rate is 100% of all eggs recovered. What protocol would you suggest? Should I do IUI or IVF? I have no tube or sperm issues.
I don’t see the age of the patient so it’s not easy to say – there’s no full clinical picture. But, yes, it’s true – if you have very low AMH and low antral follical count, the natural stimulation, Clomid, or stimulation with a low dosage of FSH is really useful. But the question is: while doing the stimulation, we get just a few oocytes; what are the chances of these oocytes to be mature, to be well-fertilized and to turn into high-quality embryo at least on day 3? We would more likely work with a blastocyst, because the longer we are cultivating them, the more information we have about the potential of the embryos and if they are really not getting into the blastocyst stage, so the possibility of them being implanted is very low. It’s a debate issue – I know. We debate about this a lot at scientific meetings, but generally the natural stimulation is fine in this case. It’s good that the fertilization rate is 100%, so the question is: what is the patient’s age? How many oocytes is she producing and what is the quality of the embryo transferred? So we could continue trying with those low dosages of stimulation and the treatment regimen as it is, but also thinking about analysing previous attempts, embryological data and the quality of the embryos. IVF would be better in this case, because while doing IUI we only help the oocyte and the sperm to meet, but we don’t check if the fertilization occurred, what the quality of the fertilized embryo was, if there was an embryo for sure, how it developed and if there is potential for implantation or not. So IVF is more recommended here.
Should I try IVF with own eggs at the age of 46 or should I start with donor eggs?
Even though we have no statistical data for the own stimulation for such patients. Usually the older patients who are included in the analysis are women who are 42, sometimes 44. Over 45 this is the age where we don’t recommend or try stimulation with own eggs and we start the treatment with donor eggs immediately to increase the chances and to have the best results.
I have had 2 failed donor egg cycles at a clinic in Spain. Now I’m at a crossroads and don’t know whether to choose another clinic or try a new donor at the same clinic? I was not offered any genetic screening.
The question is if there was embryo transfer on day 3 or on day 5. What was the quality? Because we also have the grading of the embryos, which is: the advanced blastocyst, blastocyst category A, B, or C. The genetics also plays a very important role. There is also no information regarding endometrium thickness and the absence of the immune disease of the patient and the full screening of the patient. That is why I really do not know what to advise here. If you could contact us and send more information, not only about the egg donation cycle itself, but also about the medical condition of the patient in that case, so then we would be able to advise accordingly. And regarding the genetic screening, the data says that 30% of the embryos could be potentially aneuploid, even for the donor cycle. But even with transferring one embryo or transferring even two embryos, it is too much. Usually we should get pregnant at the first or, maximum, at the second attempt with the egg donation treatment.
I had 2 failed IVFs with donor eggs. What should I do?
You should definitely continue your way into motherhood. Again, this question refers to question number 7. If you are screened really deeply, if you did the investigation of your endometrium, your immune system and screening of the embryos, etc. as we already know which play a very important role. The question here is to get the medical history, to get the records of what has been done.
I recently lost my ovaries to a borderline tumour, but I still have my uterus. What impact does this have on the hormone treatment prior to IVF?
This is a really interesting question. I haven’t mentioned it here, but we are also working with the patients who are going to be treated for different kind of tumours and we perform cryopreservation of the ovarian tissue before any kind of multi-chemotherapy or radiation treatment for the pelvis, if they are needed. However, if this is ovary tumour, it is not the usual practice we use. The question is how long ago the treatment was performed. Usually after two years of the period without recovery…we are able to send confirmation that the IVF treatment could take place. After receiving this conclusion from the treating physician, the oncologist, we are able to accept this patient for IVF. In that case, we would recommend IVF with egg donation and those patients get pregnant. They are not different from those who have different reasons for using IVF with donor eggs. The impact of the hormonal treatment prior to IVF, in the case where we are going to do the embryo transfer of the embryos created with donor eggs and the partner’s sperm, the preparation will be very minimal, just with low dosage of estrogen, we just need to follow the natural cycle even without ovaries. We have the ovarian cycle and the uterus cycle, so it can be predictable. We recommend very low dosage hormonal replacement therapy to perform the transfer. But, the question is, when can we start? And how long ago, in that case, was the treatment for the tumour performed? If the oncologist is already able to provide us with their conclusion regarding trying IVF.
Do you have access to frozen oocytes? What is your opinion about them with respect to risk vs. ease of timing for combined cycle and travel?
Yes, we do have frozen oocytes. We have had a bank of vitrified donor eggs since 2008. At the moment we have about 5,000 oocytes or even more. You can select the donor in our online donor egg database by selecting vitrified oocytes. There are two options: fresh and vitrified. You can contact the coordinators and they will help you to understand how the database works. If we are talking about the risks of using vitrified oocytes or the statistical results with them, there is no statistically significant difference at all. The issue is more related to the fact that for vitrified cycle, we recommend and perform those cycles with a limited number of the oocytes. More often, the basic package includes just 8 eggs. If we are talking about statistical data with using 8 vitrified oocytes and compare it with at least 12 mature fresh eggs, the outcome is different and the selection of the embryos is different and the cumulative pregnancy rate is different as well. The statistical data, however, says, that for cycles with vitrified oocytes, the rate is 59%, compared to 64% with fresh oocytes. I believe the crucial role is the initial number of the oocytes per cycle and the difference is here, not in the difference in statistical data.
For a combined cycle we can use either fresh donor oocytes together with retrieved oocytes from the patient or vitrified oocytes. Vitrified eggs are more recommended for combined cycle, because there is no need for synchronisation. Sometimes the older patients do not respond as we expect. The average longitude of the stimulation cycle should be 12 days. Patients with low ovarian reserve usually have shorter stimulation because the number of follicles which are retrieved is very small. It means sometimes we can have stimulation on 8-9 days, if the donor is not ready after that time, so for those cases vitrified oocytes are beneficial so we can thaw them at any time. So this is a good option.
I am 42 years old with very diminished ovarian reserve. What are my chances of success with own eggs for PGS with gender selection?
Statistically we calculate this for women over 40, because the maturation level of the oocytes, fertilization level, etc. are lower. On average, we would need 6-8 fresh eggs from the patient in order to create one blastocyst, to be able to biopsy this blastocyst and perform genetic testing. Compared to egg donation, we would need on average 4 oocytes in order to have a blastocyst. For older patients, the number of oocytes needed for one blastocyst is also higher. If we are talking statistically again, if we have very diminished ovarian reserve which means that by one stimulation we can provide likely 2-3 oocytes, in order to have at least 6 eggs, we need to have statistically 3 stimulations. And then, from those 6 oocytes we could potentially have 1 blastocyst which can potentially be euploid only with only 15% being normal. Statistically, it is between 3-10%, but multiple stimulation cycles would be probably needed here and with the diminished ovarian reserve the chances are really low. But I’ve never said no to anybody, if this is the reason for the question, I think it is really reasonable to try at least one stimulation to see what we are going to get from there. Then, we would see how we should proceed further.
What is the shortest time I would have to stay in Ukraine if I were to use donor eggs?
This is very practical question. Thank you very much. Usually we invite patients for initial meeting in the clinic, meeting the doctors and getting investigation done. But we can skip this if the patient has all the results in their home country. If the partner is going to come and provide the sperm sample, which is going to be frozen and later used for the fertilization of the retrieved oocytes, so the patient herself should come only for 3 days: for the embryo transfer. And these dates are always predictable, because we prescribe the stimulation protocol. Of course the ultrasound scans would be required to be done in their home country and the results to be sent to us immediately. And we will correct the protocol, we will confirm the date of the embryo transfer, but the minimum timing is 3-4 days and just one visit. But the optimal solution is to come for an initial visit to get prepared the medical papers, sign the medical papers, do evaluation, arrange tests to be performed which probably cannot be performed in their home country and then come again. During that visit the partner can come as well and have his sperm sample frozen. Then the lady can come for the embryo transfer one and a half month later.
What is the statistics (success rate) for fresh eggs vs. frozen eggs in Intersono, Ukraine?
This is the data for the first half of 2017. The statistical data is 64% for a cycle with fresh donor oocytes, for one embryo transfer getting clinical pregnancy which means we get a heartbeat in week 6. In case of frozen, vitrified oocytes used we have clinical pregnancy rate 59% for the same period of time.
Can you do IVF if you have diabetes that is controlled?
It depends on what type of diabetes the patient has and what would be the recommendation from the treating doctor. As I said before, any somatic status or chronic diseases should be discussed between the IVF doctor and the treating physician of the patient. Only with a confirmation letter from the physician that this patient, if we potentially perform IVF, can carry the pregnancy, we can create supportive medical treatment plan. And only after this confirmation we can perform the treatment itself.
You mentioned that you have donors from Africa and China as well. Do you also provide sperm donation as well?
Yes for both questions. We cooperate with agencies in South Africa, Asia, China, in different parts of the world, because our patients come from all over the world. We need to have those options available. Mostly those donors are called travelling donors. We do not have them available immediately in Ukraine, but by communicating with the agencies we plan the treatment cycles for them and they come for fresh stimulation. They start the stimulation in their home country and then they come for the egg collection, and the patient comes as well. The final step of the IVF treatment takes place in our clinic. We also do sperm donation as well, from Ukrainian and international donors as well.
IVF protocol over 40
I am 47 years old from the UK and want to try donor eggs. Do I stand a chance?
Yes. I should mention that even if the age is a negative predictor, but while we get high quality embryos or euploid embryos, so then the chances for different age categories of the patients are the same. So it means that even if you are 47, but you get high quality euploid embryos, the percentage of the implantation for you would be the same as for younger woman with high quality embryos. Implantation does not play such a crucial role for patients of different age. We are able to implant the embryo until the woman has her menstruation or even after that, in case we have the hormonal replacement therapy and we prepare the uterus for the implantation. With donor eggs at that age, the chances are really high, as high as 64% with fresh eggs or 49% with vitrified eggs.
I can also see a question about single women. By law we can accept single women for IVF treatment and there are no contraindications. We can treat the official couples, couples who are not married but live together or single women. It refers to regular IVF treatment and egg donation treatment.
Can I do IVF or egg donor procedure without additional scans having Hashimoto and anti-TPO high? Anti-TG are OK.
Yes, if Hashimoto is confirmed and the level of the antibodies thyroid gland is high, the additional test for immune activity is recommended to be done. Usually for those patients the levels will be evaluated. This is also the point that we should do the immune treatment for that patient. Yes, this patient could have IVF or egg donation procedure but with the immune treatment. It would increase the chances for the implantation and is really needed for that case.
Do you also have a clinic in the UK?
As we have been a part of Medicover group since 2013. Medicover is private health care provider in the central and eastern Europe, and not only Europe. There are three branches: medical health care and Medicover fertility. Medicover fertility has a clinic which is called Reproductive House Group in Manchester and we are in one group by now. They also get vitrified oocytes from Ukraine. We are able to export oocytes into the UK according to patients’ needs and you may have the treatment with the vitrified donor oocytes in the UK, in that clinic in Manchester.
If the clinic helps with visa processing, how long does it take for the visa to be ready?
Yes, we help with the process. We can send letters which you can present at the consulate or other authority you require in order to get the visa. How long does it take? From our side, to prepare the documents it doesn’t take long. You just need to have your passport and the dates of the treatment scheduled, and we will send it immediately. But how long it takes from the other side we don’t know and we have no influence over that. You need to find out from your country’s institution or the consulate.
I have a fibroid but I was told by several doctors that fibroid was not causing a problem. However, I had 2 failed IVFs with donor eggs at day 5 blastocyst perfect grade. One in the UK, one in Cyprus. Now we have decided to have donor egg and sperm. Could you advise us if that is OK? I’m on folic acid, aspirin 75mg and cyclo-progynova (to regulate cycle). Intralipid 20% on transfer day. There are also other medications involved in the treatment. How many embryos should we transfer?
A very nice question. The fibroid, depending where it is located, may be a cause for miscarriage, but they couldn’t be or shouldn’t be. If the doctor says it shouldn’t be a problem, it probably shouldn’t be. If it’s not the fibroid which impacts the endometrium cavity. But two failed IVF attempts without implantation mean that there is probably an issue with implantation, not the issue related to the quality of the embryo, because it was perfect grade and blastocyst day 5. You should analyse your implantation potential. Maybe the window of implantation, maybe the IVF treatment (you’ve mentioned here intralipids) so this is what we would probably recommend as well, but also your endometrium should be investigated further. We also recommend vitamins and low dosage of aspirin and sometimes prednisolone as well for patients who are preparing themselves for the treatment cycle. In that case IVF ED treatment I would really recommend. What are the other medications? It’s up to the dose which you’ve mentioned before. It’s only prednisolone. How many embryos should we transfer? We transfer one or two. We’re not able to transfer three embryos except in the case of failed negative multiple cycles before (by multiple I mean more than three) or if we have very low quality of embryos. However, we do this very rarely. Mostly we transfer two embryos if they are not screened genetically, but in many cases we transfer just one in order to avoid multiple pregnancies because the implantation rate is high, so success rate is also high. For the last 6 months, we’ve had 6% of twins which is really high. We started to think about transferring one embryo per transfer.
Is arterial hypertension a contraindication for IVF with donor eggs, because of the higher preeclampsia risk?
No, arterial hypertension is not a contraindication for IVF, only in cases with really high blood pressure. This all can be treated. Again we’re talking about the somatic status and the chronic diseases. The preeclampsia risk could be and should be treated during the pregnancy care and the control by the physician during the pregnancy itself. You should be treated by both doctors: the IVF doctor and the physician treating your hypertension status.
My Hashimoto/anti TP results are varying from 250 to 1,300 and Hashimoto is confirmed with ultra sonograph exam. I have had 7 IVF treatments, one with success/pregnancy but lost in 8th week (natural abortion due to genetic failure). Can this be due to Hashimoto and do I need to cure it additionally?
Yes, both. If the genetic failure is confirmed here, so probably the main issue was the genetic failure. But such low success rate for 7 IVFs and just one implantation probably is connected to Hashimoto and the level of the antibodies. The additional treatment and the IVF LG treatment would be recommended here. This would have a great impact on the success. And I need to mention that sometimes we recommend the IVF LG treatment not only for the implantation on the day of the embryo transfer but also after initial infusion – it’s valid for 28 days. But for some patients with really significant immune issues we recommend to do this even until 12 weeks of the pregnancy. We have patients who are successfully pregnant but they fly again every month at least three times until they reach the end of the first trimester in order to overcome the issues of early miscarriages in those cases.
I have had 3 failed IVFs with own eggs, very high AMH which give loads of follicles but very little mature eggs. Should I move to donor eggs?
No, probably not. But the question is: how old is Sharon? Potentially if there is high AMH, this is just the question of selecting the best stimulation protocol. In such a case, the recommended protocol would be the step-up protocol starting from a little bit lower dosage of the FSH or the stimulation drugs in the beginning, not to recruit so many follicles at once. Then, increase the dosage in order to allow those follicles which are already recruited to grow. Then, the number of the mature eggs can be much higher. We want to have a good number of oocytes. If the potential of the ovaries is so high, that we could expect the OHSS (the syndrome of the hyperstimulation), we always have the possibility to select, and to freeze the oocytes or the embryos and transfer them in the next cycle in order not to have the risk of the OHSS, but to have a good number of the oocytes that further create embryos. So no egg donation is needed, but the right treatment regimen for Sharon.
Dear participants, thank you for all the questions!
IVF for women over 40
Discussions about average success rates of IVF over 40 is a common topic among women on infertility forums and a frequent subject of the e-mails we receive from female patients from all over the world. Women in their forties and fifties constitute a big part of patients who use EggDonationFriends and fertility clinics’ services. Patients who are interested in IVF for women over 40 want to know:
- what are their chances of naturally getting pregnant after 40,
- what are the chances of IVF for women over 40,
- what is the best fertility treatment over 40,
- what are the best fertility clinics for women over 40,
- should I use donor eggs and sperm if I’m over 40.
IUI, IVF with donor and own eggs after 40 – your options
To help women get the answers to these burning questions, EggDonationFriends and fertility doctors from Intersono IVF Clinic (L’viv, Ukraine) have organized an educational webinar about the process of IVF for women over 40 and 45. The webinar was free and available to take part for everyone who registered in time.
If you have just started trying for a baby, you know you have a few options: IUI, in vitro fertilization with own eggs, in vitro fertilization with donor eggs or surrogacy. While you may consider surrogacy or adoption as your last resort option, you need to be aware that the some of the options mentioned are more successful than others. It has been confirmed that in most medical cases, women above 40 have more successful treatment with standard in vitro with donor eggs rather than treatments like IUI or mini IVF. If you are looking for more detailed information on the subject, this webinar is for you.
Thanks to the webinar “IVF with donor eggs for woman 40+” patients were able to learn much more about IVF over 40 and even ask their own questions after the presentation. The webinar was presented by Dr Uljana Dorofeyeva who is a Medical Director at Intersono, an IVF clinic where 5,000 IVF babies have been born so far, and also one of the best fertility clinics for over 40. The clinic offer is very wide and it includes, among many others:
- IVF for single women,
- sperm donation,
- embryo donation,
- sex selection/family balancing,
- PGS & PGD testing,
- maximum donor egg recipient age which is 54,
- HCV/HBV positive patients (female, male)
- egg donation – fresh & frozen eggs cycle.
Dr Dorofeyeva, the webinar’s presenter, is an IVF specialist, ultrasound diagnostics and fertility preservation expert. During the webinar she gave in-depth presentation on IVF over 40 which lasted approximately 45 minutes and then we opened Questions &Answers section which turned out to be extremely popular with attendees. Dr Uljana was answering the patients’ questions for additional 30 minutes. Many attendees had their questions prepared in advance to ask the doctor. There were many specific questions for example how health issues like asthma or rheumatic arthritis and medication which is prescribed by your treating doctor influence fertility treatment, its success rate, the potential pregnancy and delivery.
IVF over 40 – what should I know?
EggDonationFriends are aware that fertility treatment over 40 and 45 may be a bigger challenge for the patient and doctors, but it is doable. Many happy mothers confirm that. You should know that you are not alone with your worries and uncertainties. If you are considering or planning IVF over 40, this webinar is exactly for you.
Once again, EggDonationFriends would like to thank all participants for taking part in the webinar and Questions & Answers part. We have noted that the webinar was also popular with men who are supporting their wives and partners on their fertility journey over 40. Stay tuned for more webinars from EggDonationFriends, and follow us on Facebook.